Wednesday, May 30, 2007

Update on Livesay International Situation & Chargeback

Since my last posting on Livesay International, I have since received the chargeback from my credit card company.

Livesay International never refunded a single cent to me - Nor did they ever intend to. Their refund claims to me on eBay and a host of other sites are totally bogus and are a bunch of lies.

This is the real proof of my refund through the chargeback I had to file with my credit card company - A process which took a month and a half of investigation by Visa.

Be warned, don't wait for Livesay International to refund you. Start the chargeback with your credit card company immediately!


Anonymous said...

Hi there. Like you, I was scammed by these guys, but I've taken a tact of letting every official agency I can think of know about it.

Below is the letter I sent. So far, I've heard back from the local cbs affiliate and I'm hoping they'll do a scam story on these guys!


Dear Sirs:

I am writing this letter to make a formal complaint against an internet wholesaler/retailer that conducts business under the name “Livesay International.” Their physical address is reported to be at:

Livesay International
1081 Commerce Dr
Bogart Georgia 30622
Telephone: 888-987-6937

The firm also is listed on the website of the Better Business Bureau of Metro Atlanta as:

livesay international inc
PO Box 721
Athens, GA 30603-0721
Telephone: (706) 540-3866

The company operates an internet website at:

The proprietor/CEO is listed as Mr. Lyle Livesay.

I believe this retailer is guilty of Internet Crime as defined by United States government’s Internet Crime Complaint Center which includes, but may not be limited to, false advertising, non-delivery of goods, and fraud.

Company claims
The company claims on its website: “We are a supplier of Premier consumer electronics. We have recently expanded our market online, and hope to make many more lasting business relationships. We sell to Individuals and Companies alike.”

Complaint specifics
In early March, 2007, the company was advertising for sale on its website a Nintendo “Wii Value Pack” consisting of the base Nintendo Wii unit, an extra remote control, an extra ‘nunchuck’ controller, and six Wii games at a price of $349.95. Note that the company no longer offers this package for sale.

On March 8, 2007, I placed an order online through Livesay’s website with payment made via American Express. I received confirmation of that order the same day. By March 14, the order still showed ‘processing’ on the website. On March 15, I received an email indicating my order had shipped and I was provided with a UPS tracking number. The UPS number never updated and on March 17, the owner, Mr. Livesay, posted a claim on his website saying that they were having difficulties with their supplier, that orders showed as having shipped had in fact not shipped. By March 20, my credit card had been charged, but there was no update on the delivery status and the company had become unresponsive. By March 22, the company was claiming that they were picking up two shipments from their supplier and expected to ship individual orders shortly. On March 27, they indicated they had taken possession of 1 of the 2 shipments and were in the process of shipping out individual . At this point, other customers were beginning to post concerns and complaints on the Livesay website. Livesay then cancelled website accounts, including mine, by these posters and removed all negative comments from their website. In addition, I believe he began posting falsified praise for the company from fictitious users claiming to have received their orders.

On April 2, Livesay indicated they were checking on my order again, that the order showed as being on the shipping dock, and would likely ship in 2 days. On the April 4, Livesay again said it was on the dock and would ship in 1-2 days. On April 5, I decided to check if the UPS number originally assigned back in March was still good and Livesay first said it wasn’t, then checked again and said it was. On April 10, after contacting the company numerous times, I was assured that the package would ship the following day. Three days later, the package was “still on the dock and waiting to be picked up by UPS.”

At this point, Livesay began blaming shipping problems on UPS, saying that UPS wouldn’t send them a truck to pick up their shipments. On April 16, I spoke with “Steven” at the Company and was told my order was there on the dock, that UPS was the problem, but that I was number 78 on the shipping list and that since UPS was picking up 25-50 packages per day, my order should go out in no more than 2-4 days. On April 24, I received another email guaranteeing the order would ship in two days. I also spoke to Chris on that day who told me I was now number 200 and they were shipping 70-100 per day. On May 2, I spoke with Todd who informed me that their computers were down, but UPS was due to send a truck on Friday to take a large number of orders. As compensation for the delay in delivering my order, Todd offered to refund my money and send me the order for free.

On Friday, May 4, I phoned the UPS hub in Atlanta to verify whether they were in fact due to pick up an order at the Livesay address as the Company had indicated. A UPS employee, Stetson, informed me that they were not scheduled to pick anything up. When I explained that I believed that Livesay was blaming their non-performance on UPS, Stetson actually called Livesay personally to find out what was going on. He called me back and informed me that Livesay said they were going to ship soon and that they had confirmed to him they would be issuing my refund. Also on Friday, May 4, I called American Express to dispute the charge to my credit card.

On Friday, May 11, I spoke with “Ryan.” He informed me that my refund had been issued to the billing department the prior week, that I was now number 2100 on the shipping list, but that UPS was going to pick everything up by Monday, May 14. Also on the 11th, Livesay issued what appeared to be a broadcast email to customers saying that many packages had shipped. I again contacted the company by email and on Thursday, May 17th, Chris at the company wrote the following:
“I do apologize that it has taken me so long to get back to you. I have
been trying really hard to locate exactly who your package was sent by
and when. Due to the confusion and fast pace the shipping department
moved in, I cannot give you an exact date in which your package will
be arriving to you or your tracking number, but it shows in the
system that your package was shipped by UPS on Tuesday morning. I do
not want to hold your money against your will, so if your package does
not arrive to you by Wednesday the 23rd of next week, I will be happy
to refund you for the full amount. Also, if it does not come in 5 days
and you are willing to wait 5 more days for shipping then on Wednesday
I will personally package up a new order for you and ship it to you
that day. I do apologize that this has been a longer process than
planned and hope that you are not unsatisfied with the company. If
there is anything that I can do to help you furthermore, please don't
hesitate to ask. Thanks for being a patient and understanding customer!

This clearly illustrates that he was unaware that the Company had agreed to issue a refund already. When I pointed that out by return email, there was no reply.

As of today, May 23rd, the unit has not arrived. The company has not responded to my last email or to numerous requests to speak directly to Mr. Livesay.

I believe it is clear that Company does not and has, in fact, never intended to fulfill this order.

A recent internet search on Google returned 366 references to “Livesay International.” Many of these refer to posts on message boards indicating that the posters had also been scammed by the firm. They are listed on eBay as a scam site. A number of other consumers have written blogs about their experiences being scammed by this company.

I had hoped to resolve this with the company amicably. However, I have asked them to simply pull the unit from the line and ship it personally. They have not chosen to do so. Nor have I received the promised refund.

My hope in filing this complaint is the persons behind the website will be investigated and shut down with appropriate criminal charges filed. I have documentation of all emails received and sent and am happy to provide these upon request as evidence.

A copy of this complaint is being filed with:
 State Attorney General of Georgia
 Federal Trade Commission
 The FBI’s Internet Crime Complain Center
 The Better Business Bureau
 The Clark County Sheriff’s department
, the credit card processing company
 All consumer reporters of local Atlanta news stations

Thank you for your attention in this matter. I am available to discuss the complaint at any time and can be reached by phone during business hours at 281-276-6440.


Lee M. Ahlstrom

Anonymous said...

Hello, like everyone else who has purchase something from Livesay International I been scammed and lie to about the 2 Nintendo Wii/Zelda's I was hoping to get. That was back in April 18th, Now it is June 4th. I ask for a Refund May 15th and they sent me 2 e-mails with Statements on it and left a voice message about it on my cell phone. I called them about 7 business day's later to see whats the hold up on my refund. I spoke to a Lyle there and gave me some excuses and more stories about his problems getting Nintendo Wii's. He also gave me a phone number to his Merchant service guy. All I get is a rcording and never get return phone calls.

I have reported them to the BBB, FTC, FBI Internet Crime Center. I also have made a report on Yesterday I updated it due to Chris from Livesay felt he needed to save face for Livesay. These crooks are something else.

Not only do they rip us off they slso have us make disputes about it to our credit card company's and banks. They are slick con men only interest is to keep our money and never refund us a penny.

I hope Livesay International pay's the price for their criminal actions.


Anonymous said...

woohooo!!!! i am soooooooooo glad that those scammers have been shut down!! i haop they get what the deserve! they caused so much anxiety for so many. be more careful everyone!!

Nick said...

Lee M. Ahlstrom, Christopher and the last Anonymous person.

Please call Detective McCauley @ 706-613-3888 ext. 283.

He is trying making a criminal case out of this. He just needs people to let him know what happened and when. Basically he just started because of some BS on who's jurisdiction it is. He needs to know officially who has been scammed. Pass the word along

Feel free to email me,


Anonymous said...

Thanks for posting pictures of this d-bag. He owes me and some people i know aorund 110,000 USD. Yes over a hundred thousand dollars. My lawyer has sent him a couple of notices; Just waiting for him to not reply and then we start proceedings to get this person behind bars. How did you get his pictures? Anymore info about him that we dont already know about him would be useful.

minimoe said...

To the last anonymous poster requesting more information on Lyle Livesay, email me directly at

I will be happy to answer your questions and give you information to help you out.

Anonymous said...

I doubt that ypu still are monitoring this but heyNever hurts to post. LYLE is back at it with a car scam this time. here is the link to the story.